LIBBY GERMAN & ABBY WILLIAMS: Indiana vs. Richard Allen for 2017 murder of two Delphi girls *GUILTY* (11 Viewers)

On February 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams and Liberty German were discovered near the Monon High Bridge Trail, which is part of the Delphi Historic Trails in Delphi, Indiana, United States, after the young girls had disappeared from the same trail the previous day. The murders have received significant media coverage because a photo and audio recording of an individual believed to be the girls' murderer was found on German's smartphone. Despite the audio and video recordings of the suspect that have been circulated and the more than 26,000 tips that police have received, no arrest in the case has been made.[1][2][3]



Police have not publicly stated nor released details of how the girls were murdered.[6] As early as February 15, 2017, Indiana State Police began circulating a still image of an individual reportedly seen on the Monon High Bridge Trail near where the two friends were slain; the grainy photograph appearing to capture a Caucasian male, with hands in pockets, walking on the rail bridge, head down, toward the girls.[4] A few days later, the person in the photograph was named the prime suspect in the double-homicide.[5]

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant,[7] though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." It was at this news conference that officials credited the source of the audio and imagery to German's smartphone, and, further, regarded her as a hero for having had the uncanny foresight and fortitude to record the exchange in secret. Police indicated that additional evidence from the phone had been secured, but that they did not release it so as not to "compromise any future trial." By this time, the reward offered in the case was set at $41,000.[5]

Murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On Feb 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams & Liberty German were discovered in Delphi, #INDIANA. The suspect in their deaths is awaiting trial.

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant, though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." Even with a lot of media coverage, their murders remain unsolved.

www.crimewatchers.net

 

[Tresir]

What the heck is third party evidence with regard to the search? Who is the third party? I don't know that I've ever heard of this, so not clear on what they mean by that.

As far as the other suspect thing, to introduce such requires a high standard they have to meet and they didn't have that. They can't just go accusing people they can't place there, etc. although they sure (unethically imo) tried with their Frank's memo they made sure all saw.

Jmo.

I am not sure what is meant either but a guess could be evidence from the searchers themselves maybe ?

 

[GrandmaBear]

I am not sure what is meant either but a guess could be evidence from the searchers themselves maybe ?

That's as good of a guess as any.

 

[SheWhoMustNotBeNamed]

Richard Allen's attorneys file new evidence in Delphi double murder case

New evidence has been filed by the defense team of the convicted Delphi murderer as the attempts to reverse his conviction.Our partners at WTTV report that Rich

wsbt.com

Richard Allen's attorneys file new evidence in Delphi double murder case
New evidence has been filed by the defense team of the convicted Delphi murderer as the attempts to reverse his conviction.

Our partners at WTTV report that Richard Allen's defense team filed the evidence Monday, just over a year after he was found guilty for the 2017 murders of Abby Williams and Libby German.

The newly filed documents contain evidence that is related to the Odinism theory, along with several depositions from key investigators.

The initial trial judge had ruled out any evidence that pointed toward other suspects, such as the idea that several practitioners of Odinism had killed the girls in a ritualistic sacrifice.

https://fox59.com/news/odinism-evidence-filed-in-delphi-murders-case-as-richard-allen-appeals-conviction/

Odinism evidence filed in Delphi murders case as Richard Allen appeals conviction​

A new batch of evidence that has never been seen outside of a courtroom was filed Monday as part of Richard Allen’s efforts to reverse his conviction in the murders of Abby Williams and Libby German.


The newly-filed evidence came at the request of Allen’s appellate team, which indicated it needed the evidence pursue the appeal.

It was a massive blow to Allen’s defense strategy when Judge Fran Gull ruled that his attorneys could not introduce any evidence during the jury trial that pointed towards another suspect in the killing. His defense team had planned to try and convince a jury that several practitioners of a religion known as Odinism had killed the girls in a ritualistic sacrifice.

Judge Gull ruled there was not enough “nexus” or connection between the supposed third-party suspects and the crime.

The 1,200 pages of material released Monday are from the Franks hearing held in September 2023, and they contain loads of evidence related the Odinism theory along with several depositions of key investigators.

Many of the exhibits are posts made by a man named Brad Holder, who is a confirmed Odinist and was looked into by investigators. Holder’s son was a friend of Abby Williams.

Some of the exhibits include a photo of a large branch covering two people, which is similar to the layout of the crime scene.

Also included is a painting Holder did that resembles the way one of the girls’ bodies was posed and several posts of symbols made with sticks. Allen lawyers claim sticks at the crime scene were deliberately placed on the girls’ bodies to make Odinist symbols.

“Remember, they thought it was two people and they released sketches of two people, and they asked the entire nation to identify those two people, neither of whom was the eventual defendant,” Defense Attorney John Tompkins said.

Tompkins has followed the case closely, and recently told FOX59/CBS4 that be believes challenging Judge Gull’s decision to not allow any of that evidence will be the strongest argument for Allen’s appeal.

“The jury needs to understand this was not a single perpetrator theory, and this guy was not the first guy that you wanted to arrest,” Tompkins said.


FULL DOCUMENTS:

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2025/11/NonConfidentialSuppExhVol1pdf-combined-2.pdf

 

[Tresir]

Well now we know its the old Franks memo again.

I am not sure how this will help, as none of those guys were at the scene, yet RA himself was.

 

[GrandmaBear]

That Frank's memo remains the most ridiculous thing I've ever read or seen filed by lawyers. I did not read all of it as I recall as the first dozens of pages I think it was was--way more than enough.

I won't rush to read anything further relating to that.

They couldn't place a single one at the scene.

Furthermore, RA would have had to be with them were it true and so he'd still be guilty and this really isn't a third party defense of just others. The evidence against RA would still exist.

I'm not going to rush to read any appeals in this case. No desire to whatsoever. He is where he belongs.

 

[Tresir]

I just watched this. I had never bothered watching before but it is the detective confronting RA with the bullet evidence and other evidence. He continually denies it is his bullet and the detective even mentions it matching the bullet in his keepsake box.

Then the detective brings in Kathy and he still denies it. The detective then starts swearing and Rick asks if his wife can leave, and the detective lets her out. Rick then virtually threatens him and says you'll pay for this.

The end is a phone recording of RA speaking to Kathy and his mum where he is confessing to them and they are saying "No you didn't" and "You don't know what you're saying" plus they are saying his meds have messed him up.

Anyway whole thing is about an hour.

 

[GrandmaBear]

I just watched this. I had never bothered watching before but it is the detective confronting RA with the bullet evidence and other evidence. He continually denies it is his bullet and the detective even mentions it matching the bullet in his keepsake box.

Then the detective brings in Kathy and he still denies it. The detective then starts swearing and Rick asks if his wife can leave, and the detective lets her out. Rick then virtually threatens him and says you'll pay for this.

The end is a phone recording of RA speaking to Kathy and his mum where he is confessing to them and they are saying "No you didn't" and "You don't know what you're saying" plus they are saying his meds have messed him up.

Anyway whole thing is about an hour.

Going to watch when I get a chance. Some things to handle and haven't finished another video yet if I do clear up some life sh*t.

I did somewhere in the last week or two see something about an appeal and how it is raising the same ridiculous stuff those two attys. did or some such and the Frank's memo. Not sure, didn't watch it, was just mentioned in another video OR a headline, not sure.

Isn't it interesting that now that he's been convicted all the b.s. quieted right down? Where are all the "he is innocent people" now?

 

[Regina]

In the video above, I think it was very telling when he told his wife: "This is exactly what I would never want for you and there's nothing I can do about it."
To me, it sounds like "You won't cope well but they have me."
And very near the end, over the phone, he said "So if i did it, then you guys don't love me anymore?"
I think their continual disbelief was convincing him that they may not.

 

[GrandmaBear]

In the video above, I think it was very telling when he told his wife: "This is exactly what I would never want for you and there's nothing I can do about it."
To me, it sounds like "You won't cope well but they have me."
And very near the end, over the phone, he said "So if i did it, then you guys don't love me anymore?"
I think their continual disbelief was convincing him that they may not.

I saw many, many, who had not decided on his guilt who attended this trial, and without fail, all of them said after hearing the evidence, the confessions, etc. they were flat out convinced of his guilt. I think not livestreaming it or even recording it was a very bad decision as those who couldn't see it could still keep their belief that he is innocent. He isn't. IMHO.

 

[Regina]

I saw many, many, who had not decided on his guilt who attended this trial, and without fail, all of them said after hearing the evidence, the confessions, etc. they were flat out convinced of his guilt. I think not livestreaming it or even recording it was a very bad decision as those who couldn't see it could still keep their belief that he is innocent. He isn't. IMHO.

Yeah, you know, it's sad but true that we can't rely merely on what's reported from the courtroom.
To me, this case was extraordinary in that LE was able to have what evidence had, I mean, even though the crime scene was out in the woods of a secluded nature trail, they still had audio and video and eyewitness accounts that correlated perfectly and like I've never seen before.
Needless to say, the only misfortune was misfiled info and lack of effective communication.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Yeah, you know, it's sad but true that we can't rely merely on what's reported from the courtroom.
To me, this case was extraordinary in that LE was able to have what evidence had, I mean, even though the crime scene was out in the woods of a secluded nature trail, they still had audio and video and eyewitness accounts that correlated perfectly and like I've never seen before.
Needless to say, the only misfortune was misfiled info and lack of effective communication.

Very true.

He basically outed himself in the very beginning but no one realized it. When they found that long misfiled tip, it blew wide open. Even though in the woods, thank goodness many walked the trails and drove the highway nearby, etc. and once they put things together with those witnesses and Libby's video, and searched his home and got a match on ballistics, they were off and running.

 

[Regina]

Very true.

He basically outed himself in the very beginning but no one realized it. When they found that long misfiled tip, it blew wide open. Even though in the woods, thank goodness many walked the trails and drove the highway nearby, etc. and once they put things together with those witnesses and Libby's video, and searched his home and got a match on ballistics, they were off and running.

You know, I understand misfiling but that info wasn't just a tip, it was info from someone who was actually there, in other words, info that should have been recognized as crucial to the investigation and then handled as such!

 

[GrandmaBear]

You know, I understand misfiling but that info wasn't just a tip, it was info from someone who was actually there, in other words, info that should have been recognized as crucial to the investigation and then handled as such!

I don't disagree. He was a conservation officer and it was fairly early on but it was entirely sloppy all the way around. One can only hope the department learned its lesson.

You know, I don't want to go into detail on what case but in my home area, there was a case once if I recall where that type of "officer" was the first to respond from a very small county/town and the perp walked right past him I believe. This was in a rural setting, not like anyone else was walking that road! As it turned out, he was caught not too long after and so it didn't end up turning into a big deal (the fact he missed him) but this was a pretty big case and the man was dangerous and could have hurt more people.

My point is small departments, small areas, and cases unlike they've ever seen and early on in an investigation not knowing how to handle it and organize it and so on... The right hand not knowing what the left is doing...

But yes, it wasn't just misfiling. And why didn't he ever follow up or say anything as to hey what happened about that guy who was there??? Talking Delphi I mean now.

 

[Guess Who]

You know, I understand misfiling but that info wasn't just a tip, it was info from someone who was actually there, in other words, info that should have been recognized as crucial to the investigation and then handled as such!

Makes you wonder how many cases could have been solved in the beginning with an overlooked, vital tip.

 

[Regina]

I don't disagree. He was a conservation officer and it was fairly early on but it was entirely sloppy all the way around. One can only hope the department learned its lesson.

You know, I don't want to go into detail on what case but in my home area, there was a case once if I recall where that type of "officer" was the first to respond from a very small county/town and the perp walked right past him I believe. This was in a rural setting, not like anyone else was walking that road! As it turned out, he was caught not too long after and so it didn't end up turning into a big deal (the fact he missed him) but this was a pretty big case and the man was dangerous and could have hurt more people.

My point is small departments, small areas, and cases unlike they've ever seen and early on in an investigation not knowing how to handle it and organize it and so on... The right hand not knowing what the left is doing...

But yes, it wasn't just misfiling. And why didn't he ever follow up or say anything as to hey what happened about that guy who was there??? Talking Delphi I mean now.

Yeah, you know, actually, a conservation officer shouldn't have handled that tip in the first place, I mean, info from anyone who was actually there should have been categorized as more than a tip and handled by a real (lol) investigator (I think you know what I mean).

 

[GrandmaBear]

Yeah, you know, actually, a conservation officer shouldn't have handled that tip in the first place, I mean, info from anyone who was actually there should have been categorized as more than a tip and handled by a real (lol) investigator (I think you know what I mean).

I do know what you mean. I doubt somehow though it's all that uncommon in small towns that aren't used to such crimes and don't have that big of departments. HOWEVER, once this was determined to be a major crime, they should have fast been setting up a system and getting help and have maybe yes cut out such help. There are also clerks and various staff that file who we know have been blamed for many a mistake in cases. It's not always officers (of any kind lol) but in this case it was, albeit a conservation officer. I think we've heard the term clerical error more than once in cases. But no, it wasn't ideal for him to be taking tips. Or how about county coroners who determine cause of death and have had little actual training and no medical experience, etc. That does happen too...

 

[SheWhoMustNotBeNamed]

Delphi murders | Richard Allen's attorneys explain why they think his conviction should be overturned

Allen was convicted for the murders of Abby Williams and Libby German. His attorneys say he was never able to defend himself at trial.

www.wthr.com

Delphi murders | Richard Allen's attorneys explain why they think his conviction should be overturned​

Lawyers for the man convicted in the Delphi murders have filed their full argument for his appeal with the Indiana Court of Appeals.

Starting with Allen's arrest, his lawyers raised serious concerns with the investigation and the trial, ultimately appealing to the Indiana Supreme Court over their conflicts with Special Judge Frances Gull.

Those issues feature prominently on the appeal, which was filed on Wednesday, Dec. 17.

According to Allen's attorneys, these are the three main issues they have with his trial:

1. They believe the search of Allen's home was unconstitutional, and the evidence gathered inside should have been inadmissible in court because "law enforcement omitted or altered key facts in the warrant application."
2. They believe that the confessions Allen made while being held in solitary confinement at a state prison before his trial were "involuntary, the product of unconstitutional detention and inadmissible."
3. They believe the court denied Allen "his right to a fair trial, to present a complete defense, to explain the scene and impeach the investigation."

Allen's attorneys say an expert, Dawn Perlmutter, found seven hallmarks of Norse Pagan ritual at the murder scene:

1. Location - Norse Pagan rituals often happen outdoors, in the woods, near water. The girls were murdered outdoors in a forest near a creek.
2. Date - Norse Pagan rituals often occur on Norse holidays or events. The girls were murdered on Valisblot, a holiday honoring the son of Odin, the chief god of the Norse Pagan religion.
3. Murder weapon - Ritual killings often involve a knife or ceremonial knife. The girls were killed with a knife that made an "unusual" mark.
4. Sticks - Ritualistic crimes usually involve symbolism. The expert felt the sticks over the girls' bodies were not meant to hide them because "they're absolutely not working that way" and instead believes they were forming Norse runes.
5. Manner of death - Ritual sacrifices often involve blood loss and torture. The girls' prolonged blood loss is "indicative of a sacrificial offering or initiation."
6. Body arrangement - In rituals, the sacrifice is often arranged in a significant way. The arrangement of Abby Williams body allegedly mirrors the way Odin is depicted in certain Norse myths.
7. Unusual blood pattern - Ritual sacrifice often involves a symbolic blood pattern. The expert believed the blood park on the tree was a rune.

Allen's attorneys say "law enforcement bungled the investigation into ritual killing or suspects connected to Norse Paganism." The defense was not allowed to point out that police did not investigate several alternative suspects "because they lost evidence, mishandled interviews and conducted a poor investigation."

 

[GrandmaBear]

Good Lord, same old stuff. A third party defense it has been said many, many times, is a high bar to be able to have one. They could not place ANYONE there that they could tie to such, even the public understands that but the attorneys apparently do not.

How many crimes happened outside? In the woods? Near water? Are they all Norse Pagan? How many murders have happened onany Norse holiday or event? How many killings are done by knife? Are they all Pagan? And so on and so on and so on.

Dawn Perlmutter is very unimpressive.

Sorry if anyone disagrees but it is jmo.

 

[Tresir]

Good Lord, same old stuff. A third party defense it has been said many, many times, is a high bar to be able to have one. They could not place ANYONE there that they could tie to such, even the public understands that but the attorneys apparently do not.

How many crimes happened outside? In the woods? Near water? Are they all Norse Pagan? How many murders have happened onany Norse holiday or event? How many killings are done by knife? Are they all Pagan? And so on and so on and so on.

Dawn Perlmutter is very unimpressive.

Sorry if anyone disagrees but it is jmo.

No i don't disagree at all. Many reasons but how come nobody saw these O's or their vehicles and how did they manage to leave a bullet belonging to RA at the murder scene?

The other things they mention need addressing though.

An "illegal" search. How so?
The confessions were voluntary I thought.
His detention was for his own safety.

I can't see this going anywhere.

 

[GrandmaBear]

No i don't disagree at all. Many reasons but how come nobody saw these O's or their vehicles and how did they manage to leave a bullet belonging to RA at the murder scene?

The other things they mention need addressing though.

An "illegal" search. How so?
The confessions were voluntary I thought.
His detention was for his own safety.

I can't see this going anywhere.

Yeah, I didn't bother addressing as it's all the same old stuff and we've already wrung it out to death right lol? I think they tried every one of these things before and of course were denied but were told they had to take care of it at the trial court level first and now that that's over they can appeal for real instead of doing it as their stunt and delay constantly throughout.

I'm not reading it, I quit reading anything from the defense after how many pages into the Frank's memo, that was it for me. I did, however, stay abreast by listening to Tom cover it all.

I'm sure they give their reasons for each, at least if they've learned anything they have lol.

I think I can recall their reasoning for the most part but not going to rehash it.

I don't see it going anywhere either. He's no different than anyone else, they all appeal after a 1st degree murder conviction, nothing to get excited about imo. It takes major errors for an appeals court to do much of anything and even more for a retrial. Sometimes they will agree with something also but say it isn't enough that it would have made a difference based on everything else, etc.

I don't see them finding in their favor on any of it though.